OK here is the deal. I need to get 2 EVM12Ls & I need to decide which one I need.

I can easily find 2 used 8ohm EVMs for about 100$ each & wire them in series for a 16ohm cabinet.

Or I can get 2 16ohm EVMs which will cost me probably double the price or more, because I'll have to buy them new & do parallel for an 8 ohm cabinet.

Now my question is if there is any difference in sound for speakers wired in series or parallel? I'm mainly interested in the smoothness of the top end.

Hey, Kevin, I think you've answered your own question. Do you want smooth or stressed? Smooth is always way underpowered from what it can really give.

The sound of speakers in parallel vs in series largely depends on your amp and (OK, tinfoil hat on, please.) quality of the amplification and connections.)

Smooth is never under stress.

My 2¢.

I'd be interested in the outcome of this, too...as I've been thinking about wiring a harness for my Bassman 4x10 to make it 8ohms and feed it with the Fralin amp...then plug them all back into the bassman amp for their original 2ohm combo.

quote:

Originally posted by Dot:
Hey, Kevin, I think you've answered your own question. Do you want smooth or stressed? Smooth is always way underpowered from what it can really give.

The sound of speakers in parallel vs in series largely depends on your amp and (OK, tinfoil hat on, please.) quality of the amplification and connections.)

Smooth is never under stress.

My 2¢.

OK, now I feel a little stupid, because I don't really see how I had my question answered. Do you mean I should go for 2x8ohm setup?

In either case it's going to be underpowered. My 120wt cab with V30s is still underpowered, 400wt will be underpowered for sure.
Here is how I came up with EVM idea: I really liked how it sounded, but the top end wasn't smooth when it was in the mesa 1x12. Now from my observation, having owned both mesa & bogner 2x12s with v30s, the same v30s(2x16ohm parallel) sound with ear bleeding top end in the mesa cabinet & amazingly smooth in the bogner. If I can achieve the same smoothness by having 2xEVMs in a bogner cab I'll be more than happy.

My amps can run at 4,8 & 16 ohm, so overall impedance doesn't bother me.

I still have the bogner 1x12, I could also try the 1x12 bogner setup with EVM, which I'm sure will be smoother listening to the v30 in it. However 2x12 is much more smoother, probably one of the reasons is like you said that the speakers in the 2x12 are underpowered & also because of the bigger size of the cabinet (OS 2x12 is almost the same size as the 4x12 bogner).

I agree with Dot. A speaker rated for high power is going to break up less and have less cone cry, with a amp rated at 1/2 it's power rating or less.
Basically you hear the amp without artifact from the speaker.

I love the EVM 12's with my Boogies, but....If you want a speaker that is really smooth on top try a Cannabis Rex. Highly recommended for Bassman amps also.

I also think You are right about the cabinet effect, there larger volume gives the speaker more breathing space and allows the sound to unfold. At least to my ears.

Now the ohms issue, When there is an ohms mismatch a fizzyness (some would call it early breakup) seems to become part of the sound. It's not really risky with an all tube amp, but load mismatch is certain death to most solid state amps.
The biggest difference in the amps you have is at 16 ohms you're using all of the transformers windings, resulting in a smoother/darker tone.
A 4ohm load will sound brighter, the inductance of the unused coils may result in a tone you're finding undesirable.

quote:

I agree with Dot. A speaker rated for high power is going to break up less and have less cone cry, with a amp rated at 1/2 it's power rating or less.
Basically you hear the amp without artifact from the speaker.

I love the EVM 12's with my Boogies, but....If you want a speaker that is really smooth on top try a Cannabis Rex. Highly recommended for Bassman amps also.

That's exactly what I'm looking for. GK100 was another contender, but I prefer the EVM for its extended frequency response.

quote:

Now the ohms issue, When there is an ohms mismatch a fizzyness (some would call it early breakup) seems to become part of the sound. It's not really risky with an all tube amp, but load mismatch is certain death to most solid state amps.
The biggest difference in the amps you have is at 16 ohms you're using all of the transformers windings, resulting in a smoother/darker tone.
A 4ohm load will sound brighter, the inductance of the unused coils may result in a tone you're finding undesirable. Tooth

So are you saying that 2x8ohm EVMs wired in series with my amp running at 16ohm will sound smoother than 2x16ohms in parallel under 8 ohm?

quote:

So are you saying that 2x8ohm EVMs wired in series with my amp running at 16ohm will sound smoother than 2x16ohms in parallel under 8 ohm?

Running at 16 ohms you will be using all of the windings of your output tranformer, Provided you are selecting the 16 ohm output, the result should be a darker/smoother tone.
So in my experience....yes

Helpful site on wiring

http://www.bcae1.com/spkrmlti.htm

Thanks! You just saved me 200$

This wouldn't save you money...but have you tried the EV Black Label (Zakk Wylde) speakers?

Might be just what you are looking for.
Also, you might only need one.
They ROCK as a single 12 with Bogner and Divided by 13 heads.

Loud and Clear

DOH!

Didn't know that the EVM12L IS a Black Label...
Where have you seen 8ohm for $100?

I want one

OK, this is starting to get interesting.

There is EVM12L Classic 200wt & EVM12L BL 300wt. I was talking about the classic version.

Have you tried both?

Not lately, The 300W one was what I was referring to.

The 200W is the one that everyone had back in the 80's I think. I was a strict Vintage 30 user.
I would guess that the 300W is more of what you are after.

jmp

The black Labels where recently introduced, with excellent reviews from Boogie owners

Which one did you like single 300wt 8ohm? What cabinet was it in?

It was a 300W in a HiWatt Combo that had been converted to a closed back cab.

jmp

Well, it's hard to have any idea other than trying one I guess. The way they explain it is that BL has better power handling, improved magnet. From what I know improved magnet can change the sound dramatically. Celestion installed an improved magnet on their 75s & it sounds like a completely different speaker now & it is, they sell it as GK100 now. On one hand I want to try one, on the other I just want to stick to what I know, I'm really tired of testing stuff.

Can anybody explain me how stereo/mono wiring works? Maybe a link to a diagram or something.

Not sure what your actually looking for? Bridging a power amp to mono? Turning a 200 watt stereo amp into a 400watt?? Doubling the power will only obtain a 3db gain in SPL.

Here's an brief explanation of bridging a stereo amp to mono.
When you mono bridge an amp you run the two channels at opposite polarity, but tie them across one load. This means the voltage swing is twice what it normally would be. When one terminal is at its most positive voltage the other is at its most negative. So you get a lot more power, but it's from a voltage increase. There isn't necessarily going to be more current available. Speakers require lots of current, especially for the lowest frequencies.

quote:

Originally posted by Dutchman:
Not sure what your actually looking for? Bridging a power amp to mono? Turning a 200 watt stereo amp into a 400watt?? Doubling the power will only obtain a 3db gain in SPL.

I should be more specific. When you have 2 jacks for running the cabinet mono or stereo, how is it wired (the cab)?

You have your standard mono wiring and then a "Shorting Jack" is inserted into the circuit so that one switch is used only for Mono...then when you plug into the other switch, it splits into stereo.

jmp