Yeah, EZD is pretty smooth to use.

The "humanizer" seems to work better than BFD and the drag an drop from the preview window is really nice. The EZD vintage kit extension sounds pretty nice. I tend to like the EZD vintage samples over the BFD stuff in a side by side.

Tracy, hooking up a drum map to your midi track is pretty straightforward. EZD isn't a bad way to go and it's relatively cheap. The vintage kit sounds really nice, old Ringo/Zep kit with Zildjian and Paiste cymbals. The only thing with EZD is that it's much more resource intense than BFD, lot's of space required.

The Groove Monkey stuff isn't bad. It comes with drum maps for BFD, EZD, etc. Some pretty decent patterns.

I have no idea what you guys are talking about in terms of BDF and EZD MIDI hookups, but it seems to me that by the time you go through all the paces on something like that you could just sequence the drum parts outright. If it’s routine for you to do so then it’s really not that big of a deal. To sequence my drum tracks I just use an old Korg O2W fd. The tracks are sequenced in 8 or 12 bar sections, not loops, so that a vibe is established. Things like hits and fills are usually done once the basic groove is laid down, but they are done sparingly Once I have the drum tracks where I want them I’ll go back and quantize to about 80% or so. . just enough to keep a human feel to the whole thing.

Yet, I also play a real kit (a Premier Birch kit with Sabian cymbals). The decision to use a real kit or to sequence is always determined by the song and the vibe I wish to capture. There are pros and cons to both. As for sequencing parts, it is a pain, but in the long run it’s easier to manage come mix time. That’s one good aspect of this approach.

Chris

quote:

Originally posted by Killian:
I have no idea what you guys are talking about in terms of BDF and EZD MIDI hookups, but it seems to me that by the time you go through all the paces on something like that you could just sequence the drum parts outright.
Chris

There is no "paces" to go through...I've done drum sequencing since the '80s using everything from a Korg M1 to a Roland MC50, etc...There is nothing easier than this...You can build a basic track for your song in 15 minutes...If you're still using an old Korg to sequence drums, you're doing yourself a dis-service...

You're really missing out if you don't check out ToonTracks site and watch the video tutorials...This software is the easiest and most streamline thing to use for creating drum tracks for songwriting, or for anything!

The thing about the midi clips is that they were played by real drummers...the feel is there, the fills are wicked...Just drag and drop into your sequencer after you preview them first...It's so simple it's ridiculous...

I've found nothing better or more realistic and easy to mix that "Drums on Demand" with Acid.

I’ll definitely check out ToonTracks ASAP. It sounds very cool.

As with any new experience there’s a bit of apprehension associated with treading unfamiliar ground. So, please excuse my ignorance on this, but if I wanted to use ToonTracks where would I start? My current setup consists of a Roland 1880, routed to my computer via a converter, and as previously mentioned I have an old Korg sequencer.

Currently, I don’t have any sequencing software, BUT I have no problem investing in something if it would be worth my time. Do I need some sort of software to send the MIDI files to?

Thanks in advance for the info and your assistance.

Cheers,

Chris

Hey Chris,

ToonTracks is simply a software synth that runs on a PC or MAC. The program is made up drum samples that are triggered by midi. ToonTracks has something new called EZPlayer Pro, which is essentially a software sequencer that is dedicated to building midi tracks...it's much more than that, but that's the gist... So you would need to venture into the world of DAW sequencers and such...

ToonTrack has a great video tutorial on their website about EZPlayer Pro as well as EZD (EZ Drummer) tutorials -- EZDrummer is the core software package that is made up of the drum samples and the interface to those samples...

i have a song in the mp3 format right now, that utilizes the stock Ezdrummer software.

i'm also in the middle of mixing a song done with ACID, which i can post if anyone GAF.....

quote:

Originally posted by wretchasketch:
Trying to make a usable artificial drum track makes me feel so stupid...even though I only need the simplest of drums. I just want a good country backbeat with brushes or a choo-choo train type shuffle rhythm. I don't need fills or anything.

EZ Drummer with the Nashville expansion pack is exactly what you're looking for. Train beats, brushes, it's all there.

For the other poster wondering how EZ works; in my DAW (Digital Performer) you open the EZ drummer as a plugin, audition midi loops via their browser, and then drag and drop your selected 2 bar loop into the sequence window of the DAW. Then you loop it or copy and paste it as far as you want it to go.

Generally, you use one loop for the verse, another for the chorus. In fact, that's how they're organized in EZ. They give you a style, and then inside the folder for that style, they give you intro versions, verse versions, chorus versions, bridge versions, and fills. It's so easy to throw together a song, it's ridiculous. Then, as the song shapes up, you can put in your stops and fills as needed, either by finding fills in the EZ browser, or just programming them yourself with a midi keyboard, or by note manipulation in your DAW.

quote:

EZ Drummer with the Nashville expansion pack is exactly what you're looking for. Train beats, brushes, it's all there.

It might very well be what I need or it might not. I'd have to hear the patterns to know, and I'd have to buy it to hear it. It would be nice if you could download a demo or hear snippets of everything online. The samples they had up of the Nashville expansion sounded nice to me, though. I just want to make sure it has a rhythm that will match the music I want to make.

Wretch...call down to ProAudioSolutions on 8th. They will let you demo it on one of the machines in store. I know one of the guys there actually owns the Nashville pack...don't remember his name off hand, but there's not that many guys working there. Tell them you want to demo it--they'll either tell you to come on down whenever or set up an appointment.

Now, you may have to demo it on a Mac, which won't tell you how it will perform on your notebook...but, if it's content you're concerned with, I'm sure they would let you sit and goof with it for a while.

Correct me if I'm wrong EZDrummer users...as I seem to remember it being LESS CPU/HD intensive than BFD, but requiring more RAM, since it loads everything into RAM--no disk streaming. That would make it technically a good candidate for a laptop that has a lot of RAM.

quote:

Originally posted by Popmann:
Correct me if I'm wrong EZDrummer users...as I seem to remember it being LESS CPU/HD intensive than BFD, but requiring more RAM, since it loads everything into RAM--no disk streaming. That would make it technically a good candidate for a laptop that has a lot of RAM.

That is correct...Only about 256MB it uses. Works perfectly on my laptop. Don't know about BFD but Drums From Hell, DFH, was a memory monster..800MB up to 1.4GB...

WELL, FOR ME...
the whole thing about using ezd isn't to drag and drop patterns, and then write something to go along with it...]


i Craft my songs first...
completely arrange them.


THEN

i record a basic rhythm guitar track as a 'go-by', and i BUILD the drum track around my arrangement.

i "teach" my drummer the arrangement, and then MAKE him/her play it exactly the way i want!!


LOL

I was playing around with the Nashville EZD last night and mucked around more with Slates Drumagog in parallel...It's pretty freakin slammin...

One shouldn't forget that if you have a good trigger kit like VDrums, a live drummer on that translates almost perfectly when you actually playback through EZD...

Mucho good info here, I'm going to check them all out.

Rob, I'm with you on building the drums to fit the song, rather than having the drums dictate the song structure.
I usually repeat a simple loop to keep the meter, and build the core of the song, prior to getting to advanced on the drum tracks.

quote:

Originally posted by Popmann:
Correct me if I'm wrong EZDrummer users...as I seem to remember it being LESS CPU/HD intensive than BFD, but requiring more RAM, since it loads everything into RAM--no disk streaming. That would make it technically a good candidate for a laptop that has a lot of RAM.

It uses a good amount of RAM, relatively speaking, especially the sets with sets with more/larger samples, such as Claustrofobic and and Twisted, which won't even load on my notebook, because, unfortunately, it is maxed with only 1.25 GB of RAM.

The Pop/Rock, Vintage Rock, Drumkit From Hell and Latin Drumkits will load with no problems. The P/R, Vintage, and DFH, have sample libraries of over 500mb to around 650 mb and will load up to over 250mb at a time depending on the set. With, for example, a Pop/Rock kit, the Ram usage, while idle, on a lean laptop, is around 750 MB. This is with Tracktion and nothing running in the background.

The Claustrofobic library is like 1.2gb and the Twisted library is about 850 mb. Those sets just won't load with my measly 1.25 gb of RAM and will freeze, making you have to remove EZDrummer (deleting the filter/plug-in) and restarting it. Some other DAWs will completely crash.

Anyway, just thought I'd share. FWIW, my laptop is an Athlon 64 3000+.

My desktop is getting long in the tooth, relatively speaking, and I'm looking at Core 2 Duos and Quads. The thing with the new machines is they mostly come with Vista and it is a hog, using anywhere from 1.2gb to almost 2gb of RAM while idling, while only being able to utilize about 3.3gb of RAM (on a 32 bit system....more on a 64 bit system, but.....). I haven't played with Vista and don't know how much can be lapped off of it's processes but I'm deciding which way to go......maybe a dual boot system if that would work.

BFD ran all the stock kits plus Deluxe kits on my 4 or 5 year old P4 2.6 w/1.5GB RAM without an issue. FWIW. It has an option to load the whole kit into RAM, but why, unless you're having issues. I think when I looked, they tended to use about 4-500mb of RAM to buffer.

So, I have or have used all of the EZdrummer packs except for the Nashville set, have BFD, including Joe Barisi samples, and tonight tried Addictive Drums.

All I can say is wow, I LOVE Addictive Drums.
It is as easy to use as EZDrummer, loads samples WAY faster, sounds MUCH better, and is much more flexible, while still being easy to use. The flexibility lends for a much broader palette of sounds.....and it is down right FUN to edit. Yes, it's addictive alright.

So, my take is this:

BFD: a tweakers delight I guess, but really, I don't want to dick around quite that much (not that it's mandatory). I don't really like the interface too much.....it's just....well....it feels like it get's in my way sometimes.

If I were a drummer, I'd probably pick it so that I could dick around enough to feel important (just JOKING!!!!).

EZDrummer: It's easy, sounds decent to good (sometimes not so good at all - I was so disappointed with the Drumkit from Hell.....processed to death and the snares sound like roto-tom snares....no body). The Claustrophobic kit is cool, the Classic set has it's place, and the Twisted kit is a stone cold blast.....still.....

Addictive Drums: The main kit (Startup) sounds very, very good. Much better than EZDrummer. In a side by side, I though it put it to shame, really.

It could use a humanizing function, but when I play/program I am the humanizing function .

Drag and drop midi files the same as EZDrummer.

The editing of sounds is very concise and very useful. It is mostly done with several edit points that you simply click and drag.....the ears determine what to do.

Pick a drum, pick *the* drum, edit pitch (start, hold, release), volume (actually attack, decay, sustain and release), there's a filter that is so simple, yet so effective, mic position for the bass (beater to front), compressor, distortions (mild effect), EQ, Sat (mild effect). In all, you can tweak whatever kit piece you want in seconds to a minute or so and go from subtle/just right to making a completely different sound. So simple, yet so useful.

In all, I think I will be using Addictive Drums from now on (I'm certain, actually). nbarts was right on with his assessment. Dutchman, or anyone else looking to get a drum program, you have to try Addictive Drums out. I really believe that overall, it may be the best of the bunch for the pseudo-drummer in us.

Welcome to the club.

quote:

It might very well be what I need or it might not.

Tracy, Killian, I'll pop up a quick clip in the Music Station of a jug band type shuffle idea I had the other day so you can get an idea of what's going on. Nothing special, just a scratch idea. Used my great grand pap's Vaudeville baritone Uke in a little bit of it for yucks.

I find problems always arise when you try to edit grooves in any package, as the grooves are generally played in its very difficult to add a few convincing snare hits or kicks.

Samples not a problem, recently I have played with adding the supersonic samples (don't worry I have bought them for live drums as well) underneath decent sound drums for more presence and kick whilst retaining an acoustic feel.

So sound wise with the help of this forums I have sorted the drum sound, but you can't get past it, the grooves generally just dont cut it, they are either funk ridden or heavy metal beats thats sound silly.