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Kyudan
Picture of Popmann
Posted
I feel like I grew up recording. I remember days of recording a cassette to my boombox, playing that tape on the big stereo while performing the next part to a different cassette in the boom box. By 16 I had a 4 track cassette and by 18 had outfitted that with all the makings of a demo studio--a compressor, two digital FX units, DAT, MIDI sequencer(PowerTraxPro-Mac?), drum machine and synth.

I had the demo thing down. I would sequence drums and keys...then use the mixer of the 4trk and both FX boxes to mix the MIDI modules along with a live played along bass track to stereo cassette tracks. Then 2 tracks of guitars/(real)piano, and mix the rhythm tracks to DAT. Send them back through onto two center tracks, leaving a track for lead gtr/harm vox, and one for lead vocals.

Took a few days per song from the start of a the drum sequencing to the final DAT mix.

I worked part time at a local studio with bigger gear. Mostly doing arranging, but I'd help out with the engineering where they overlapped.

At 21 or so, I decided I needed to be able to experiment with more complex musical ideas than one could pull off on a 4trk and a 32voice synth. Or in the band I was in at the time. So, I saved my pennies to start building a little place I affectionately refer to as Thee Dungeon.

Little did I know that would be one of the greatest misjudgements of my life. To be continued...


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Posts: 6304 | Location: Twangville, TN | Registered:: 01-06-03Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Kyudan
Picture of Popmann
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So, I put together a killer hybrid studio. 8trk analog...SMPTE striped to drive a "fancy" sequencer running a rack of synth modules...all coming back to a Mackie mixer.

I really stepped beyond the commercial studio I worked in...in terms of sonics.

My biggest lesson? Giving the ability to work with more diverse and complex arrangement ideas does NOT equal the ability to do it well.

Enter the huge MUSICAL learning curve.


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Posts: 6304 | Location: Twangville, TN | Registered:: 01-06-03Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Kyudan
Picture of Popmann
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Once I musically caught up...several key pieces died, and/or were on their last legs. Damn used gear...

...So I decided to go all "in the box". Computers, save TDM systems, couldn't do it well yet...so, brand new Roland VS 1680 was the direction I went.

And this was the only time I spent a lot of money on gear for my studio and had it sound worse than it did before.

This was what made me research gear. Turns out, it was a lot of things--the pres, converters, EQ, compressors, and mixer on the 1680 sounded awful. RDAC wasn't a plus (but no where near the worst offence compared to the others).

I did a whole record with it. I change preamps...converters...I compressed on the way in...it all got a little better. Emphasis on "little". Wink

So, it was out. After comparing the sound of the AkaiDPS24 to various software packages, it was time to move. The new platform brought the first foward movement from the analog days. And....the ability to easily colaborate with others remotely.

I went from the rack of synths to all software...and now almost all back to hardware for the keys. I have a dedicated G3 runnning DP3 in MIDI only mode to handle sequencing tasks. I miss Logic as a sequencer, but I do so little sequencing, it's not worth the cost of a new computer/interface/software package.


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Posts: 6304 | Location: Twangville, TN | Registered:: 01-06-03Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Kyudan
Picture of Popmann
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So...onto the last year or two's gear testing while recording my latest project.

Compressor. La3a. Love the thing. Did from the first rental. I kept renting--it never let me down. Vocals and bass sit right in the mix-boom. Bought--done. The ProVLA will stay because it has a really cool, usefull sound. Great for bringing dimension to stale 2d tracks.

MicPres: Just as with compressors, there were a lot of rentals and borrowed and purchased pres...I've ended up with A Millenia Hv3, and a UA LA610. The Hv3 does it all equally well, IMO. It always sounds like the mic. Which, depending on the mic...could be a good or bad thing. The UA is just great as a bassDI and electric guitar pre. It's also done well on other tracks that needed the faux vintage treatment. The one debate I have, though...with it's main use being the two stated things, and API killing on Egtr...and various other DIs being close...I may be better in the long run with a 512c and U5. But, for now, I'm fine.

Mics: there have been a LOT through here. But, I think I'm arriving at the final lineup for a while:

Acoustic Gtr: Sm81+Royer121 M/S. If I want a less bright, vintage tone, the Royer alone will do. Mono strummy part...the 81 does fine alone.

EleGtr: This is simple. Royer 121>hv3. Sennheiser 421>LA610(or hv3). Two tracks. Don't bother to decide which is better or blend them until mix. They are like opposites. The Royer being very true to the amp...the 421 being tougher and mid foward.

Bass: 610 DI+ SansAmp>Hv3. Again-two tracks....decide/blend later. I will never again record bass with a cheap DI. U5. 610. RedDI. GreatRiverme1nv--all variations on great bass DIs.

FX: Lexi PCM91 and Kurzweil Rumour serve as reverbs. Some combo of Akai's built ins and two old Alesis units (Mv4&Q2;) for guitar multis/delays/pitch, etc.

Vocals: My vocals...wow. Lotsa mics through here. Still...the Sm7 is pretty much the most consistent performer shy of REALLY expensive alternatives. If I could justify an M269c, U67, or an Innertube87i...they work best. But, $4-6k is too high for my vainity. The sm7 (windscreen removed) sounds more like them in overall tone/dynamics than the condensers that cost 10 times as much.

Hand percussion: sm81>hv3. Hands down. I couldn't want for a better conga or shaker mic.

So, as you can see...for me, as a musician/writer/"wish I didn't have to be an engineer" guy--it's about gear that consistently doesn't suck. I've used other mics/pres/compressors that were the bomb on this or that...in this and that combo...in this or that cycle of the moon. But, it's the stuff that I can plug in and it always renders a usable track quickly--call it the most forgiving gear...that's what is sticking around.

If I find a good female vocalist to work with, I may have to revisit the vocal mic thing. Something like the Soundelux U95 (or something else C12ish) would probably kill. Although, the M269c is being used by some of my faves there, too...so maybe I'd decide it's worth the money/trouble to bring one in.

The only really "open issue"? EQ. I've had Great River's here...and Vintech's...as well as the simple EQ on the LA610. There's no doubt in my mind that analog EQ just kills. The GR is too much money, else I'd be done with that. The Vintech wasn't nearly surgical enough (but did sound good)...I'm gonna maybe pick up a 1ch SpeckASC-T. I've heard great things about it. Price is right to buy and try.

So, expect a big garage sale of some fab stuff in the near future. I seem to have honed into my personal aesthetic--time to focus on that other stuff...what is it again? Music? Writing? Chops? hmm...novel. Big Grin


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Posts: 6304 | Location: Twangville, TN | Registered:: 01-06-03Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Sandan
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quote:
Originally posted by Popmann:

Hand percussion: sm81>hv3. Hands down. I couldn't want for a better conga or shaker mic.

novel. Big Grin


Hey Pops, try the 421 w/ congas if you get a chance,snappy- mui bueno!!
I like the SM81(x2) for overall ambience. Nice and balanced, depending on how you tune the tubs. Takes EQ nicely.
Recenlty diggin' the GT44 on the skins.
I know its your journal. but wanted to pass on some of my fav's.

T
 
Posts: 817 | Location: San Diego | Registered:: 02-24-03Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Kyudan
Picture of Popmann
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I'll give that a shot. Too bad no mic will make me play better. Wink

I had this tone going...Sm81(1.5ft above pointed down at the head)>Hv3>ProVLA that was killer...the VLA was pulling major GR, but because it's attack is so slow, it would let through the little "snap" to the hit...a sweet sound--and then I realized I couldn't come up with a good enough part and still play it throughout.

Conga, I'm afraid, might be one of those instruments like trumpet, where it's best for me to love from afar. Big Grin


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Posts: 6304 | Location: Twangville, TN | Registered:: 01-06-03Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Kyudan
Picture of Popmann
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quote:
The only really "open issue"? EQ.


Added a SpeckASC-T a while back. Does everything I need. Haven't directly compared it to the Great River, but...I figure as long as it's getting what I want, why bother tempting fate? Wink

Added a few more pieces over the last year...a second Sm81 to mic my fully restored Hamond C3/122. That pair on the open backed top....the 121 on the opposite side down low--amazing realism. Sweet. Couldn't ask for better.

Finally got the computer/MIDI side of the house ironed out. Seperate little area with an XP box running Cubase4, BFD, and some Vienna Instruments strings. Got it all wired into a little rackmount mixer for monitoring...all sync'd up to the Akai, which I can control via Cubase if need be. Nicer setup than I deserve, really, for as little drum programming or string arranging I do. But, it's there and full functional for the first time in YEARS...adding an old school MOTU MTP/AV on the parallel port seems to have alleviated my MIDI timing issues. The PC system still has some quirks, but nothing that keeps me from working. Alas, the old G3/DP3 system is now retired.

If I don't have this record done by year's end--somebody shoot me. Wink


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Posts: 6304 | Location: Twangville, TN | Registered:: 01-06-03Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Kyudan
Picture of Popmann
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Alright...I'm over a month late...but, it's almost there. I'll have the 9th of 10 songs final mixed this weekend. Maybe even the tenth...


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Posts: 6304 | Location: Twangville, TN | Registered:: 01-06-03Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Yondan

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Waiting patiently ...

Juggle

(Taps foot.)

mud


www.mudbean.com

Everyone brings joy to my room ... some by entering, some by leaving.

"He was a dreamer, a thinker, a speculative philosopher ... or, as his wife would have it, an idiot." -- Douglas Adams
 
Posts: 1274 | Location: SoCal Semi-Desert Semi-Paradise | Registered:: 11-27-04Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Shodan
Picture of WalkerGibson
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by MudBean:
Waiting patiently ...

+1. But then again, I was supposed to have my album finished by Christmas '06.


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http://www.walkergibson.com
 
Posts: 317 | Location: Lancaster, CA | Registered:: 07-29-07Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Kyudan
Picture of Popmann
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I hear you, Mud. Just finished the last mix, I'll have you know. Shh...don't tell anyone.

Tomorrow, I assemble the CD.

...then I can finally get to the woodshedding. "The year of the bass" is already two months shorter than expected.


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Posts: 6304 | Location: Twangville, TN | Registered:: 01-06-03Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Yondan

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Well, well, well ... received a happy surprise in the mailbox - a CD from a James Lang in Nashville!

Good work, man - how does it feel to get this off your plate?

You know, I'm a big fan of LangSongs - this is good material ... are you planning on a pro mastering job? I think that this project rates it fer sure. I look forward to hearing it with that final magic pop and sparkle.

Thanks, Jamie! Applaud

Ed


www.mudbean.com

Everyone brings joy to my room ... some by entering, some by leaving.

"He was a dreamer, a thinker, a speculative philosopher ... or, as his wife would have it, an idiot." -- Douglas Adams
 
Posts: 1274 | Location: SoCal Semi-Desert Semi-Paradise | Registered:: 11-27-04Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Yondan

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O.K., follow-up ... lived with this album in the player for a few days ...

Jamie, I know you work on one o' them Digital Automatic Wizzdoodle thingamabobs ... have you printed a "Vocals Up" mix? Just, like, push 'em about a half dB? In some of the denser sections, I'm losing a bit of vox presence.

mud


www.mudbean.com

Everyone brings joy to my room ... some by entering, some by leaving.

"He was a dreamer, a thinker, a speculative philosopher ... or, as his wife would have it, an idiot." -- Douglas Adams
 
Posts: 1274 | Location: SoCal Semi-Desert Semi-Paradise | Registered:: 11-27-04Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Kyudan
Picture of Popmann
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No vocal up mixes...funny you mention that...if anything, I'd have made some vocal DOWN mixes. I think I tend to err on the side of a bit too much...I hear you on the denser sections. I'd bet they're on the innertube tracks.

10 tracks...2 87ai>Great River...3 Sm7b>LA610...5 Innertube87i>Millenia tracks...care to guess which is which? Wink

I'm considering mastering options...but, I think if I were to pro master it, I'd have to put it up for sale to at least make that money back...and I don't know if that's it's destiny.

Glad to hear you like it.

Studio note: I've been looking at my mics...and what I used on stuff over the course of the record. Some things I sort of found the perfect matches...and some got a lot of different mics.

Vocals: see above.

Acoustic guitar: almost all Sm81(s). A few of the earliest tracks were the TLM193 and 4033 combo--but they got printed with heavy EQ (Great River) to balance the two disparate sounding mics. The very last track I recorded (Atthe End of the Day) the acoustic is the TLM193...just didn't want that bright'ish sound of the 81s.

Leslie: you hear a lot of experimenting. Pair of 4033s on Commencement...awful sounding M/S with an 81 and the Royer 121 on "don't give up"...and finally "the" way to track it on Water on the Stone--pair of 81s up top, with the 121 on the lower rotor.

Electric guitar: 90% my Bassman. A few modeller tracks (Amplitube and my analog V-Stack pedal)that just had too much vibe to the take to redo. But, here's the interesting thing--I used about every mic in my closet on some amp track along the way--Sm7, Sm57, MD421, Royer121, 4033, and a Mojave modded MXL...and often a blend of two different mics. I don't know that I had a "goto" set up for the amp. If I had to throw something up and know I could live with it? 121+57 for clean...121+421 for dirty. Royer through the Hv3, dynamics through the LA610. But, I LOVE the tone on the clean GirlI Used to Know track--and it's a 4033>LA610. LOVE the dirty Tele on Harvest--it's Amplitube!

As far as external processing...the kick almost always got the ProVLA treatment...snare almost always the Speck ASCT EQ...vocals and bass mostly the La3a. Those are the only constants--and they're not 100%, but they make up a lot of the tracks.

95% of the effects came from outside the box. PCM91, Rumour, Quadraverb2, and Midiverb4. That is the weakest part of the Akai, IMO.

3 different basses. One Carvin fretlessV...My JazzV and 62RI P split the rest of them. U5 and LA610 as DI on all but a couple early ones, which I used a Radial into the DPS24 preamps. I don't own the U5, but I'd like to have one. though, speaking of mastering, the ones with the U5 will need a HPF down around 30hz, where the 610 tracks don't. Turn up "Lose You" and watch your woofers vibrate!

I've done a bit of experimenting with psuedo mastering it myself using some Waves plugs. It's really amazing what some of these newer algorithms will do...maybe I'll post about it in the mastering forum.

Anyway...having pulled some of the tracks into Cubase to play with plugs...makes me appreciate the fine sounding mixer on the Akai. It's a shame they stopped development on it--if they'd have ever added channel HPFs and the ability to compress/EQ the busses, it would be unstoppable.


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For further proof of my lack of expertise, please listen to:My Tunes
 
Posts: 6304 | Location: Twangville, TN | Registered:: 01-06-03Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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